Blurry pictures with new camera

[echo3]

A NOTE FROM ME, DIAMOND LIL
I moved posts from the tripod thread to here because there were two distinct and very good discussions going on under one title. This topic deserves it's own thread.
Lil



Good for you Ed. What kind of head did you get?
I went out today, just me, my V-Rod and my D90. It was beautiful out and I was really excited to get some good shots.
I rode along the Lackawaxen River to the Zane Gray Museum. I stopped along the river for shots and took some outside at Zane Gray.
Well, I still don't know what is wrong, but I was so disappointed. I'll put them in my D90 Gallery later. :(

[echo3]

Hey Lil, they're just not as crisp and clear as I expected. My son thinks the Canon takes much nicer pictures. I have to go to the store and make dinner. I'll put them in the D90 Gallery I opened a little later.

[Diamond Lil]

They will be more clear and crisp once we figure out what is going on.

[pegdragger]

Hey Lil, they're just not as crisp and clear as I expected. My son thinks the Canon takes much nicer pictures. I have to go to the store and make dinner. I'll put them in the D90 Gallery I opened a little later.

Makes me think that your auto focus isn't on or your metering is not set properly. Too bad Lil's meet isn't this weekend. We could all give you a little help.

[EZE RIDER]

Thanks for good write up Lil. It was a big factor in my decision.

Erin I have a simple exercise for you to do. With the camera OFF, I would like for you to get a feel for the two positions of the shutter release button. Practice this because you must stop mid way before taking any pics for the proper exposure and focus. I hope you don't mind the advice. Good luck!

[Diamond Lil]

Makes me think that your auto focus isn't on or your metering is not set properly. Too bad Lil's meet isn't this weekend. We could all give you a little help.

That or VR isn't right??? Something is off and I'm convinced it is not you or the camera. It has to be a setting.

Added
I just read Ed's post. That exercise if very worthwhile. Sometimes when I am excited over the potential to capture a shot and make a photograph easily seen at the moment I might rush that process he speaks of and blow the whole thing.


Ed, I truly hope that you are at least as happy with yours as I am with mine.
You are welcome.

[echo3]

Thanks for all the advise everyone. I have it set to auto in I think 3 places. VR is on. Sometimes I do push the button too fast, but I know when it happens and try to re-take the shot when I can. I wish we were going to Lil's this weekend too!
I'm going to put a bunch of the pics in my gallery. I'll let you know when it is done. Maybe you can tell by looking at them what is wrong!
You're all the best btw!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Springer]

Like Lil brought up about the VR I know its highly recommender by most canon shooters to disable the IS system when shooting off a solid mount. This is because the gyros are in the IS are still trying to find some thing to stabilizer even though there is nothing their too stabilize so it ends up sort of fighting it self and causes poor pic's. Their new lens are said to have taken care of this. So you may have a similar problem, try shutting off you're VR and see if that does it.

[echo3]

Thanks Springer I'll try that, I didn't quite understand it, but I'll try it!;)
It is frustrating because none of the pictures are totally out of focus, but they're not quite right either.
I'm going to upload them now. I'm going to upload most of what I took so we can maybe get an idea what is wrong...see you soon!

[Diamond Lil]

Thanks Springer I'll try that, I didn't quite understand it, but I'll try it!;)
It is frustrating because none of the pictures are totally out of focus, but they're not quite right either.
I'm going to upload them now. I'm going to upload most of what I took so we can maybe get an idea what is wrong...see you soon!


Erin, Being a Canon user these days I had to look up the terminology for your Nikon so hopefully our Nikon folks will chime in if I'm off base. Read through this and see if it makes sense. It just may help you solve the problem you described above.

AF settings - C, S or M?

C or Continuous - As the name tells you the camera focuses continuously so it is desirable for photographing moving subjects of a broad variety. It is also the setting you will end up using for the greatest majority of shots you make. Most often it is the setting to use to help solve with focus problems like back-to-middle-to-front focus issues.

S or Single - The camera will lock focus in quickly and you can make a picture quickly, once. Use this when using a tripod or for photographing non-moving subjects in controlled situations.

M or Manual - Turns the autofocus off so you can use the lens ring to focus in on your subject.

The M/A - M switch?
On the lens, you probably have an M/A - M switch. Unless you are shooting without AF engaged, meaning the M setting above, this switch should be set to M/A. The interesting thing however, is that you still can overide the AF by using the lens ring to focus. If you are holding the lens and not very careful it is possible to inadvertently alter the focus achieved by the camera by moving the ring.

AF Area Mode

Single Point AF - landscape, non-moving, close-up subjects or to focus in on one particular area within whatever you can see in the frame.

Dynamic Area AF
When used in AF-C the lens will focus on a center point and its surrounding areas which can be narrowed or expanded by going into the menu system.
In AF-S the lens will focus in on a point that you select.

[echo3]

I think you guys are onto something there...and I thought autofocus would be easy!:rofl:
Anyway, I posted the pics in my D90 Gallery http://www.moviephotoforums.com/photopost/showgallery.php?cat=599
let me know what you think.
Lil, as soon as I put my helmet, gloves and jacket on, and started my bike, one single duck comes swimming down the middle of the river (followed by that raft) of course I thought of you and shut the bike off and tried to get a shot, the pics are bad because the duck was just way too far away to get a good picture of it. I cropped a couple for you so you could at least see it! Now I'm going to need a zoom lens, see what you started! :rofl:

[Diamond Lil]

Erin, I am looking via iPhone, but they do not look as bad as you made it sound. I will have to get a look with the computer tomorrow. Thanks for thinking of
me withtbe ducks.

[echo3]

Thanks Lil, like I said, they are not terrible, but something is off. I kept willing the duck to come towards me, but he just wouldn't comply!:mad:

[Springer]

echo I was looking at you're pics and it looks like you're losing a bunch of detail because of being blown out in spots. I hope you don't mind I down loaded one and tweaked it some in Lightroom, theres lots of detail in those pic's.
Before
http://www.moviephotoforums.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=107&pictureid=1054
After
http://www.moviephotoforums.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=107&pictureid=1055
Here are some crop's to show how much detail you are getting
Before
http://www.moviephotoforums.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=107&pictureid=1059
After
http://www.moviephotoforums.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=107&pictureid=1057
Before
http://www.moviephotoforums.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=107&pictureid=1058
After
http://www.moviephotoforums.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=107&pictureid=1056

[Springer]

I think it looks more like exposure is more the problem then focus at lest on that pic.

[echo3]

[QUOTE=Springer;6925]echo I was looking at you're pics and it looks like you're losing a bunch of detail because of being blown out in spots. I hope you don't mind I down loaded one and tweaked it some in Lightroom, theres lots of detail in those pic's.

Wow Springer, what an incredible difference. How do you avoid the detail being blown out or over exposure?
I am going to have to look into Lightroom.
Thank you so much. I am really anxious to get some good pictures!

[Springer]

Was the camera set to Auto or Manual?

[echo3]

All settings were on auto. On some of the pics, like the ones looking down the river, I took 2 pics, one on all auto, and one on the landscape setting w/everything else still on auto. That is why a lot of the pics are almost the same. I was really trying to experiment.

Wow, you're right about all the detail. When you look at this picture in the large setting, you can actualy see sticks and leaves under the water.
http://www.moviephotoforums.com/photopost/data/599/medium/Zane_Gray_ride_086.JPG

[EZE RIDER]

Like Lil I'm on the Iphone right now but your last pic looks awesome! I'll take a closer look at the rest in the morning.

[Springer]

It looks like it was a pretty bright day I saw you're f/stop was around f/9 the ISO at 200 but you're shutter speed was down around 320 I'm just guessing but I think that shutter speed should have been a whole lot higher. You could try setting you're ISO down to 100 and see if that might help.

[Heavens Thunder]

Nice picture Erin ! I have not seen the sun and warmeth in three days and windy and rain and high was 58 yesterday !

[echo3]

It looks like it was a pretty bright day I saw you're f/stop was around f/9 the ISO at 200 but you're shutter speed was down around 320 I'm just guessing but I think that shutter speed should have been a whole lot higher. You could try setting you're ISO down to 100 and see if that might help.

Springer, 2 newbie questions...how can you tell what settings I used, I don't even know what I used, and...can I set my ISO while I'm using the automatic setting?
I have to learn this camera....no auto!!
Thanks for helping!!

[echo3]

[QUOTE=echot03;6965]A NOTE FROM ME, DIAMOND LIL
I moved posts from the tripod thread to here because there were two distinct and very good discussions going on under one title. This topic deserves it's own thread.
Lil



THIS IS WHY YOU ARE OUR SUPER MODERATOR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Now we need that "off topic" Smiley!
http://planetsmilies.net/happy-smiley-611.gif

[Springer]

The information is embedded in the file of the pic, when I down loaded it and then brought it up in LightRoom it will show me the settings 1/320 sec at f/9.0, ISO 200 8.9 MP

[Diamond Lil]

Here are two photographs I just made to show what a quick shutter speed can do.
The setting was Shutter Speed Priority. All else was Auto.

http://www.moviephotoforums.com/photopost/data/574/medium/IMG_6595.jpg
Shutter Speed 1/200
F/7.1
ISO 100
FL 70mm


http://www.moviephotoforums.com/photopost/data/574/medium/IMG_6597.jpg
Shutter Speed 1/1000
F/4.0
ISO 100
FL 70mm

[echo3]

What a difference Lil. I wish I knew how and when to change all those settings.
I should be out riding right now, and instead I'm playing with this silly camera.
I just took some shots of a lunar moth outside, and they are still not clear. I left it on auto.
I tried taking the VR on and off, changed the ISO etc., but still no great shots.

A question...about half the shots I tried to take of the moth with the Nikon, the camera wouldn't take the shot. I'd press the button and nothing. Same shot, same distance, zoom etc. but nothing. I never had that happen before. Does anyone know what it is?

http://www.moviephotoforums.com/photopost/data/599/medium/mothman_022.JPG

http://www.moviephotoforums.com/photopost/data/599/medium/mothman_028.JPG

Just for the fun of it, I grabbed the Canon, here are a couple from it.

http://www.moviephotoforums.com/photopost/data/599/medium/mothman_with_Canon_017.JPG

http://www.moviephotoforums.com/photopost/data/599/medium/mothman_with_Canon_018.JPG

[pegdragger]

When the camera wouldn't fire, I assume you were on manual and too close. If the camera is to close, it can't focus. You'll need to either step back or shorten the focal length.

[tude]

Springer, 2 newbie questions...how can you tell what settings I used, I don't even know what I used, and...can I set my ISO while I'm using the automatic setting?
I have to learn this camera....no auto!!
Thanks for helping!!
Erin here is a link to sim-cam where you can practice the effects on shutter and aperture (I am going back there after the pics from t-ball)..
Hope this helps

[echo3]

Yes, I'm replying to my own post. :D
Now that I see the pictures on here, they do seem to be in focus, just really dull, with both cameras.
Is that something that could be fixed with Photoshop?

[echo3]

When the camera wouldn't fire, I assume you were on manual and too close. If the camera is to close, it can't focus. You'll need to either step back or shorten the focal length.

That is the weird thing Michael. It was in auto, and sometimes it would take it as at a certain distance, then it wouldn't.

[echo3]

Erin here is a link to sim-cam where you can practice the effects on shutter and aperture (I am going back there after the pics from t-ball)..
Hope this helps

Thanks Mike, I'll check it out after my ride. You guys are great for trying to help an amature!

[Diamond Lil]

Erin, it very well may have to do with the amount of light coming into the lens. I am not sure what your camera does, but if you were out of range for the capability of the lens, then it is possible that the camera would not take the picture. What that means is that at the time, in that given situation the camera could not work the settings successfuly with the lens you are using.

[EZE RIDER]

Yes, I'm replying to my own post. :D
Now that I see the pictures on here, they do seem to be in focus, just really dull, with both cameras.
Is that something that could be fixed with Photoshop?

First off, I love Lunar Moths! I only discovered that they existed about 10 years ago. I have to say that they are my favorite insect to date.

Next is that your camera will not fire if there is not enough light or if your closer than the 20" minimum distance. I dont have my manual with me right now but its about 2 feet minimum distance. Dont forget that at about 12 megapixels you can crop your photo so close that you dont need to be any closer.

Erin, what picture quality are you shooting at? RAW or JPG fine, normal or basic? In Large, medium or small?

Finally, yes you can and should be using Lightroom or similar program to obtain the results that you want. Photoshop is really for professionals with a very high cost. Lightroom is more for people on our level.

[echo3]

First off, I love Lunar Moths! I only discovered that they existed about 10 years ago. I have to say that they are my favorite insect to date.

Next is that your camera will not fire if there is not enough light or if your closer than the 20" minimum distance. I dont have my manual with me right now but its about 2 feet minimum distance. Dont forget that at about 12 megapixels you can crop your photo so close that you dont need to be any closer.

Erin, what picture quality are you shooting at? RAW or JPG fine, normal or basic? In Large, medium or small?

Finally, yes you can and should be using Lightroom or similar program to obtain the results that you want. Photoshop is really for professionals with a very high cost. Lightroom is more for people on our level.


Lunar moths are so cool. That one just sat or should I say hung there for hours.
I do not know the answers to your questions. I've just had it on auto so far, and haven't changed anything.
I did take some more pics this afternoon and changed the ISO to 100 as suggested since it was very sunny. I'll try to get some in my album later.
I must have been right on the edge of where the camera would fire because sometimes it worked, and sometimes it didn't and I wasn't really moving around.
I noticed that Lightroom is not too expensive, I'm going to look into it more!
Thanks Ed!
ew....I have macro pic I took of it's head with the Canon. It is fuzzy it has ferns sticking out of it's head!:D

http://www.moviephotoforums.com/photopost/data/599/medium/mothman_with_Canon_019.JPG

[Diamond Lil]

Not to argue, but based upon what I've read about it, I'm not to sure about Lightroom for the non-pro. I'm curious why it over Photoshop Elements (https://store1.adobe.com/cfusion/store/index.cfm?store=OLS-US&view=ols_prod&category=/Applications/PhotoshopElementsWin&distributionMethod=FULL&nr=0#view=ols_prod&category=/Applications/PhotoshopElementsWin&loc=en_us&store=OLS-US)?

[EZE RIDER]

Lil Elements may me a better choice for the cost. I was imposing my desire for going a bit over the top without going too crazy. Your advice is probably better for the casual user.

[Diamond Lil]

Thanks for the clarification Ed. I've got a hankering for ugrading my own software and value your thinking.

[echo3]

I went back to the cliff over looking my hometown. I took some shots in some pretty bright sunshine. I tried setting the ISO at 100 like suggested. I think it really helped. Here is a sample, more in my D90 Album.

http://www.moviephotoforums.com/photopost/data/599/medium/the_cliff_032.JPG

[pegdragger]

I went back to the cliff over looking my hometown. I took some shots in some pretty bright sunshine. I tried setting the ISO at 100 like suggested. I think it really helped. Here is a sample, more in my D90 Album.

http://www.moviephotoforums.com/photopost/data/599/medium/the_cliff_032.JPG
Erin, that image is pretty clear. I might suggest playing with your f stop and shutter speed. Looks like if you bumped either of those, your pics wouldn't be so bright, even in that sunshine. Do you have the exif data? I would guess at ISO 100 you were probably around f10 and maybe 1/160. I may be way off, but for example if you increased that to to say f13 or f16...or perhaps 1/500 or higher you might darken that pic up and it would be perfect.

Please take this as constructive criticism. I am not always right, but what I have learned over the years is keep playing with it. Find a setting and go up and down from there. Try a shot at f10. Then try a shot at f11. And so on. Same with the 1/160. That's how you are going to learn that camera.

[Springer]

I use both Photo Shop Elements 7 & Light Room 2. PSE7 is a great program and would cover about 80% of the shooting I do, but it is meant to do a lot of thing well like repairing photos, making calenders, doing slide shows and just generally doing a lot of creative thing's with photo's. Were as LR really shines if you want to fine tune you pic's to bring out the best in it and do batch work. Since pretty much all I shoot is in RAW the camera will do no processing in the camera unlike when you shoot JPEG and the camera will bump up the sharpness and color a bit, have you ever noticed pic's that come out of Point & Shoots and how they really seem to pop there settings are bumped up even more. Id rather make those adjustments myself and get set them to what I think looks good instead relying on the camera's ballpark setting's that are meant to cover a wide range of shots.

[echo3]

Erin, that image is pretty clear. I might suggest playing with your f stop and shutter speed. Looks like if you bumped either of those, your pics wouldn't be so bright, even in that sunshine. Do you have the exif data? I would guess at ISO 100 you were probably around f10 and maybe 1/160. I may be way off, but for example if you increased that to to say f13 or f16...or perhaps 1/500 or higher you might darken that pic up and it would be perfect.

Please take this as constructive criticism. I am not always right, but what I have learned over the years is keep playing with it. Find a setting and go up and down from there. Try a shot at f10. Then try a shot at f11. And so on. Same with the 1/160. That's how you are going to learn that camera.

Geez Mike, I thought this camera was supposed to work on "auto"...
first I have to learn about ISO...now you want me to know how to get exit data...know what f10, f11....I'm just kidding!:D Ask Nick, he'll tell you I'm a bit of a smart asz!
Actually, I'm not kidding about the "auto" part. Seriously, how can they call it "auto" when you still have to make all those other adjustments?:confused:
I love all of your constructive criticism. I think I've learned so much already and I've only had the camera a week! Thank you mucho!

[echo3]

I use both Photo Shop Elements 7 & Light Room 2. PSE7 is a great program and would cover about 80% of the shooting I do, but it is meant to do a lot of thing well like repairing photos, making calenders, doing slide shows and just generally doing a lot of creative thing's with photo's. Were as LR really shines if you want to fine tune you pic's to bring out the best in it and do batch work. Since pretty much all I shoot is in RAW the camera will do no processing in the camera unlike when you shoot JPEG and the camera will bump up the sharpness and color a bit, have you ever noticed pic's that come out of Point & Shoots and how they really seem to pop there settings are bumped up even more. Id rather make those adjustments myself and get set them to what I think looks good instead relying on the camera's ballpark setting's that are meant to cover a wide range of shots.


Springer, I wish you were going to Canandaigua with us, I think we could all learn a lot from you! Come on, it's not that far :rolleyes:

[pegdragger]

Erin, the stuff I am suggesting is to be used when in manual mode. I don't know anything about being a smart ass.

[echo3]

new smiley... http://www.moviephotoforums.com/photopost/data/591/thumbs/smart_ass.jpg (http://www.moviephotoforums.com/photopost/showphoto.php?photo=6725)

[Springer]

I'm learning more about this stuff everyday. Thats why I like coming to this site so much Ive picked up stuff from every one thats posted here, thats why this has become my number one stop. I'm on another large site that has some great photographers on it but it seems like the majority of the people on that site have some major personality flaws and not the people Id want to spend much time around. Over their if you ask about something you will get some help but you also get a lot of crap form some that cant believe anyone wouldn't know that already that, and a lot of that comes from the one's that talk up what great equipment they have but you never see them post a pic. Around here everyone's willing to help if you're having a problem and everyone likes to show off their stuff. I wish it wasn't so far for that get together because I would sure like to meet some of this bunch.

[echo3]

I just googled it Springer. Only 13 hours, you can do it! Actually, some of us girls on 1130cc.com have talked about heading that way someday. If we do, we'll have to look you up!
This has become my 1st stop everyday too. Some sites hate newbies who ask lots of questions. Not here, everyone is incredibly willing to help, even researching questions if need be!
I'm glad you're here, and I'm glad you're happy here! Erin
OK Lil, we really need that group hug smiley!:)

[Springer]

Well if you guys ever do get over around this neck of the woods we've got some pretty good roads for riding and taking pic's that run along the Mississippi.:ride:

[pegdragger]

I just googled it Springer. Only 13 hours, you can do it! Actually, some of us girls on 1130cc.com have talked about heading that way someday. If we do, we'll have to look you up!
This has become my 1st stop everyday too. Some sites hate newbies who ask lots of questions. Not here, everyone is incredibly willing to help, even researching questions if need be!
I'm glad you're here, and I'm glad you're happy here! Erin
OK Lil, we really need that group hug smiley!:)

Erin, no matter how long I have been shooting for, I still feel like a newbie. I learn new stuff all the time.

[EZE RIDER]

I use both Photo Shop Elements 7 & Light Room 2. PSE7 is a great program and would cover about 80% of the shooting I do, but it is meant to do a lot of thing well like repairing photos, making calenders, doing slide shows and just generally doing a lot of creative thing's with photo's. Were as LR really shines if you want to fine tune you pic's to bring out the best in it and do batch work. Since pretty much all I shoot is in RAW the camera will do no processing in the camera unlike when you shoot JPEG and the camera will bump up the sharpness and color a bit, have you ever noticed pic's that come out of Point & Shoots and how they really seem to pop there settings are bumped up even more. Id rather make those adjustments myself and get set them to what I think looks good instead relying on the camera's ballpark setting's that are meant to cover a wide range of shots.


Thats a great description of both programs.

[EZE RIDER]

Erin this should help out a bit. I'm not sure if you checked it out yet. It's the Nikon Digitator. A video walk through of the features of the D90 from Nikon. Click here (http://www.nikonusa.com/Assets/Digital-SLR/25446-Nikon-D90/Video/digitutor/eng/d90/index.html)

[Diamond Lil]

...I thought this camera was supposed to work on "auto"...

Actually, I'm not kidding about the "auto" part. Seriously, how can they call it "auto" when you still have to make all those other adjustments?:confused:
I love all of your constructive criticism. I think I've learned so much already and I've only had the camera a week! Thank you mucho!

Erin, here is a down and dirty on the metering in the camera:

It takes a reading of the light at the subject and sets that level to middle tone for the image. If you have a bright scene, bright will be middle and the chance of overexposure exists. If you have a dark scene, dark will be made middle and the chance of underexposure exists. If you have a middle scene, it makes that the middle and your exposure works out fine.



PS
I cannot help with smileys. The ones I use are from my gallery.

[Diamond Lil]

I'm learning more about this stuff everyday. Thats why I like coming to this site so much Ive picked up stuff from every one thats posted here, thats why this has become my number one stop. I'm on another large site that has some great photographers on it but it seems like the majority of the people on that site have some major personality flaws and not the people Id want to spend much time around. Over their if you ask about something you will get some help but you also get a lot of crap form some that cant believe anyone wouldn't know that already that, and a lot of that comes from the one's that talk up what great equipment they have but you never see them post a pic. Around here everyone's willing to help if you're having a problem and everyone likes to show off their stuff. I wish it wasn't so far for that get together because I would sure like to meet some of this bunch.

JB,

There are people here who like to show off their stuff? :rofl:

In all seriousness, the people here inspire me to learn more and more. You all make me want to do better and better everyday. And the learning! It never stops for me. Everyone has something to offer. We are rich!

Those of us from the old place know that it is the members who make the difference.

[Diamond Lil]

I went back to the cliff over looking my hometown. I took some shots in some pretty bright sunshine. I tried setting the ISO at 100 like suggested. I think it really helped. Here is a sample, more in my D90 Album.

http://www.moviephotoforums.com/photopost/data/599/medium/the_cliff_032.JPG

BTW, I cannot wait to see this picture when you make it from a position of comfort using that D90. It is a wonderful composition.

[echo3]

Thank you Ed, I'm going to check it out right now! :)
Thanks Lil, I never noticed how many churches were in our town!

[scol]

I haven't read the entire thread so if it's cover let me slide. dose everyone here know what a gray card is? I suggest pick one up at camera store. Lil is right the camera uses mid gray tone so if you had a gray card you could take a reading off the card in the same light as your subject then adjust the camera. and shoot. No gray card take a reading shoot then 1 stop at the exposure the camera gives then 2 half stops under then 2 half stops over. that's five frames you have to chose from. When I shoot dig. and slide I shoot 1/2 -1 stop underexposed. Negative film 1/2- 1 stop[ over exposed. That's my personal preference. Also grass is close to med gray brick faded Rd's. you can take readings off those subjects also.

[echo3]

Wow scol, I never heard of that. Sounds very interesting. There is just so much to learn!
Thank you for sharing!:)

[scol]

Wow scol, I never heard of that. Sounds very interesting. There is just so much to learn!
Thank you for sharing!:)

My pleasure, I've been out of the photo loop for awhile and haven't talked photography with any one in quite some time. You people are helping me get my mojo back, I need to say thanks, I need to point out that photography is ever evolving and I like the many of you am still learning.

[Springer]

I got me one of those. A lot of times if I have to shoot Graduation or Engagement pictures and I know the lighting will stay the same I will shoot one of my first test shots with the subject holding a gray card. Then I can use that first test shot with the gray card in post processing as a calibration shot to set the WB for all the rest of the shots, it seems to work pretty well.